Member for Mallee - Transcript - ABC TV - Thursday 22 January 2026

‍DR ANNE WEBSTER MP

FEDERAL MEMBER FOR MALLEE

TOPICS: Nationals split, Liberal Party, hate speech laws, legislative process, cabinet solidarity, Jewish Australians, National Day of Mourning for Bondi terror attack

Mackay

Well, let's stay with this top story now, of course, The Nationals again splitting from the Liberal Party, breaking up the Coalition for a second time in the last 12 months. Leader David Littleproud says his party cannot be part of a shadow ministry under Liberal leader Sussan Ley after disagreement over the government's hate speech laws. Joining me now is Nationals member for Mallee in Victoria. Anne, Webster, thanks so much for your time this morning. So, we've just heard from Nationals leader David Littleproud, announcing the second split in the past year of the Coalition. Why has this relationship in Mr. Littleproud's words become untenable?

Webster  

Thanks Mel, very much for having me. It has been an incredibly difficult week. This legislation is very, very important and ultimately will impact every Australian. Hate speech law is complex. We went through a process, working with our Liberal colleagues, particularly the lawyers who took carriage of the amendments that we were trying to see occurred in a very tight timeframe. I mean, you have no idea! Legislation was being spoken to in the House by Michelle Rowland at a time when we were still trying to get amendments sorted, it isn't it is not just a walk in the park. This is a very complex process. We were doing that, and it occurred through the day. We have had 10 meetings as a National Party, where I'm very proud, I've got to say for our democratic processes, where we could talk through the problems, the complexities, the risks to freedoms that we all hold dear in our democratic society, and we wanted to make sure it was right. Let's just face the fact here, this is Albanese rushing through in a political timeline, yes, Sussan Ley was calling for and so was David Littleproud, calling for our parliament to resume in December to talk through the laws. We could have passed the migration component of this law as it stands, Albanese wanted to do an omnibus bill, which was an absolute mess and remains imperfect, absolutely imperfect. We separated the gun reform, we voted against that. We continue to look at amendments with regard to the hate speech laws, and we were not satisfied. Right up to when the vote was taking place in the House, we determined to abstain. We would have preferred to have gone into the House and voted no, however, out of respect for cabinet solidarity then, we abstained and we took further amendments to the Senate, which was at 10pm at night. But people don't understand how pressured and difficult this has been. This week, our senators did an incredible job. We determined in the afternoon, before the senators took those extra amendments to the Senate, that if it came … if push came to shove and the Senate did not accept our amendments, if the Liberals didn't vote with our amendments, then they would have to tender their resignations as cabinet solidarity. It's just a protocol, and that we as Shadow Cabinet, as shadow ministers ourselves, would also tender our resignations. We did not do that lightly. This was incredibly difficult. It was painful. I had tears in my eyes, because we want to stand for principles that reflect the values of Australians and we represent regional seats. I had hundreds of emails, hundreds of emails from my own electorate. Not one of them asked me to support this legislation. We will stand by our electorates. We will stand as a Party. We were absolutely united behind our senators, and we knew what the consequence was going to be before they voted no that evening. Sussan Ley had the opportunity, she had the opportunity not to accept the resignations of our three courageous senators. Well, four, including Matt, but in terms of the shadow ministry, she chose not to do that, and so it left us with no alternative. I tendered my resignation yesterday, along with my colleagues.

Mackay  

And this news coming today on Australia's National Day of Mourning for the Bondi terror attack is something that both Anthony Albanese has talked about this morning. We've heard in a statement from Sussan Ley acknowledging that today is, sort of, not a day for politics. What does that look like then for the National Party, for this, this very dramatic divorce coming today?

Webster  

Yeah, look, the divorce has happened. It's not coming. It's .. it's happened. In terms of our National Day of Mourning, I think most Australians have been mourning for a month. Today is a day of significance, and we are very cognisant of the fact that this separation really happens in the morning, because we don't want it to crash into the 7:01 moment, a minute of silence tonight. The principled position that we took with regard to this legislation was to ensure … to seek to ensure that our Jewish Australians would be safer. I am not convinced, our party room is not convinced, that antisemitism will be reduced because of this law. We are legislators. We have a job to do. We will be continuing to mourn today, to remember this National Day, and to stand with our fellow Jewish Australians, and to stand with every Australian who feels the blight of one month ago and the terror attack -  dastardly terror attack - that took place that day.

Mackay  

You touched on this a little earlier, and I just want to come back to it that this was, you know, Parliament resuming was something that the Coalition had been calling for since December. You've been asking the government to return to pass new legislation. Government has returned. There is this new legislation on the table a month later, but you're now saying that you haven't had the time that is required. So, I just wonder, how is it that you sort of can say that there hasn't been enough time to look at this legislation yet you were calling for parliament to resume a month ago?

Webster  

So, let's be really clear. Mel, let's be very, very clear. Albanese did not present us with legislation until the Sunday morning before the Monday when we were due back in in Canberra, that this is complex legislation. He then proceeded to guillotine debate in the House. I didn't get an opportunity to speak. Many of my colleagues did not even get an opportunity to speak. He restricted what is normally a 15 minute speech for legislation of this magnitude. Every legislation, 15 minute speeches, he gave us five and then he cut the debate after an hour and a half for the gun reform and not much later, for the hate crime. So, the whole process where you would have an inquiry that would normally take months, maybe a year, ie, the Royal Commission comes to mind, was cut off. We did not have proper process led by this Prime Minister. He wanted to ram through this legislation, no matter how bad it was and what it might mean to people's freedoms, in a rush, so he could score a political point. I'm not impressed, and I don't think Australians would be impressed. And as a then-Coalition, we wanted to take the time as a National Party, we wanted to take the time to look at this legislation in depth, to be able to seek out stakeholders, to work through what was, what is and remains, intricate and imperfect legislation. The outcome of this legislation, we will wait to see just how much of a lawyer's picnic it will be, but it is by no means good.

Mackay  

All right, Nationals member for Mallee in Victoria, Anne Webster, thanks very much for your time this morning. Appreciate it.

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